Anna Schueth (Maastricht University)
Welcome to the Microscopists, a bite sized bio podcast hosted by Peter O'Toole, sponsored by Zeiss Microscopy. Today on the Microscopists
Peter O'Toole:Today on the Microscopists, Anna Hsu talks about the challenges of becoming a mom early on in her academic career.
Anna Schüth:Writing a book with a baby crawling on the floor. Many, many sleepless nights, but I've done it. I defended my, PhD when he was 1 year old. But by the time, I was already post doc. So that was a tough time and I
Peter O'Toole:Her volunteer worked to champion women in STEM, including getting some fun tattoos.
Anna Schüth:I wanted to, for her to do is actually do this female hand. This female hand that is holding this very beautiful old fashioned, unique microscope because of this whole well, representation of women in STEM and so on.
Peter O'Toole:And the importance of stopping to consider what challenges your colleagues might be facing.
Anna Schüth:Realizing what your colleagues might go through and what is actually being what
Peter O'Toole:does it mean being on the autism spectrum?
Anna Schüth:You know? What does it mean autism spectrum? You know? What does it mean to have ADHD? What does it mean to have a chronic disease and so on?
Peter O'Toole:All in this episode of The Microscopist. Hi. I'm Pietro Atul from the University of York. Today on the microscopist, I'm joined by Anna Shute from Maastricht University. Anna, how are you?
Anna Schüth:Hi, Pete. So great that I can join this. I'm doing fine. What we just said earlier, it's still really warm here. So once this recording will come out in September, maybe it's not so warm anymore, but yeah.
Anna Schüth:Then I'm sitting in my Luxeando, a t shirt, Light Sheet Works. I actually turned it upside down, but but it's actually the logo is on on the other side. This is the backside of the t shirt, but I thought it was cool.
Peter O'Toole:Are you gonna comment on the t shirt? Because it does it like sheet rocks, it's a really cool t shirt to have on there. I really like it.
Anna Schüth:Exactly. So that's why I was kind of hoping they would do it, the other way around. And I saw you also have shirts from this podcast.
Peter O'Toole:We do, and you will be getting one.
Anna Schüth:Oh, wow.
Peter O'Toole:So straight afterwards, Jace will email you asking for your size, and I don't think we've got a choice of colors anymore. I think we used to. It might be black or white. I don't know. But Jason
Anna Schüth:But that's that's pretty awesome. When I was doing many years ago, 5, 6 years ago, I did this MO course at the Max Planck Institute in Dresden organized by Pavel to Mannschaq. And there, I got already a Luxembourg T shirt. I wanted to yeah. It's it was completely it was just black in the end.
Anna Schüth:Nothing was on it anymore. So I was glad when Luxembourg came over to our campus, and they did a demo there. So they brought more t shirts, so I'm now all ready to go.
Peter O'Toole:T shirt it out. I I think my team have got some of the t shirts too. I I could say, Elmi. I used to wear the Elmi t shirts quite well. Seasonal ones are popular.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. This was all, pre pandemic. Somehow I mean, I honestly haven't traveled since then. I mean, it's still a little bit weird and lots of other personal reasons. And going through divorce is also not, exactly walk in the park and then being alone with 2 little ones, but, yeah, I'm looking forward to going back there and getting t shirts and connecting with people.
Peter O'Toole:Thinking on that, we'll come to the other content in a minute, but actually I had loads of the Elmi every year. I so I had the whole series of Elmi t shirts. And in the end, actually, the friend we were talking about before we started recording when he was in hospital, so I donated them all to him. It's actually also showed he was a scientist. He wanted to make sure people were aware that he wasn't he they could talk to him and talk about the drugs he was having to take and everything.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Mhmm.
Peter O'Toole:It was just a way for him to show that he was a scientist and to just give extra detail and he kind of knew what to do. But anyway, that's an aside. So, Ella
Anna Schüth:Nice. Congratulations
Peter O'Toole:because you've now started your own academic group.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm still on my own, but it feels right, and it feels great. And, yeah, I recently started since June actually at the medical faculty at our university. And my my field will switch from what I did earlier was human brain research and a little bit of cancer to a 100% cancer, and that will be breast cancer and gynecologic cancer types.
Anna Schüth:And I'm especially excited about this because we well, my family, runs endometrial cancer. And you can't see that now, but I have a uterus tattooed on my chest, and I also have a you should see that, like, a little fetus and also, you know, like a uterus. And I'm fascinated by this whole subject of reproduction as well as oncology. And, yeah, it's a dream come true and a way to do this.
Peter O'Toole:So just notice that that those who are listening won't be able to see this, but it's actually a really cool microscope.
Anna Schüth:Oh, yeah.
Peter O'Toole:A tattoo
Anna Schüth:Oh, yes.
Peter O'Toole:As well. I bet we got old school tattoo. Not a not a fan movement hook, but Mhmm. Classic brass type.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. I, brought to my artist a few different of images, and I said, hey. This is what I like.
Anna Schüth:And what I also wanted to, for her to do is actually do this female hand. This female hand that is holding this very beautiful, old fashioned, unique microscope because of this whole representation of women in STEM and so on. And I got this for almost yeah. I wanna say my personal anniversary, let's say, 10 years in microscopy. And then I thought this would be really cool.
Anna Schüth:And, I waited also a long time until I found the right, you know, the right, design. And I also have a few from the UK from when I was at the conference. And where was it? Manchester. So that's cool.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I'm also at the Society For Neuroscience. I collect a few tattoos once I was traveling. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:So I collect t I used to have t shirts. You just have tattoos with which one that you go to. I'm looking for the forward to the microscopy tattoo.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I mean, hey. Why not? I I yeah. Sometimes people call you crazy for doing this photo key.
Anna Schüth:And I mean, my neck tattoo was quite and, statement, let's say, as well. And, Yeah. I always thought, actually, I wanna do the the full sleeves by the time I might have the faculty member job and the permanent position. But then I I don't know. It's this whole thing of, you know, life's short.
Anna Schüth:Why wait until God knows when in a few years' time? And then I thought, you know what? I'm going to do it. And within I don't remember anymore months or something. I had it all completely, full arms, the chest, and the entire back, everything.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Well, I like that.
Peter O'Toole:So you mentioned, the one with the hand on the the the lady's hand on the mask. And there's there's many things to cover today. Yeah. There's there's your career. I want to understand how you've got into where you are today.
Peter O'Toole:Women in STEM and how you've been supporting to know you're quite active, on a volunteer volunteering side for many aspects, not just women in STEM. And obviously some mental health issues in the past as well. But I'm gonna I'm gonna go back. I just I'm gonna go back to when you were a young a young child. Yes.
Peter O'Toole:And what was the first job that you can remember actually aspiring to be?
Anna Schüth:Oh, wow. That's a good question. So I I think, my mom always tells me these stories. Once I could walk, I would walk around and collect little insects and so on. So zoology and any kind of animal studies also was already very early on.
Anna Schüth:And I think when I was in kindergarten and early days of school, I wanted to become a veterinarian. I mean, I grew up on a farm where my, parents had these large animals, and this is what I really liked. I wanted to do this as well. And they would always say, ah, that's not for a girl. You know?
Anna Schüth:That's not really for you. So I went then in the direction of zoology, what I actually studied, so classic biology. And, what I also I mean, this whole science aspect. So I when I was 7, my parents gave me my first little microscope as a gift. And then I even I didn't realize it, but I made my own little lab journal.
Anna Schüth:I wrote down notes. I would draw what I saw through the microscope, and I would connect samples. I don't know. Insects, hairs from my dog or my poor father, and he had to give me some samples. And this was so yeah.
Anna Schüth:I lost I I became lost in this world of of microscopy, and that was it. I I I don't know how to explain. I mean, you know how it feels when you are imaging, but this was, for me, incredible to see these things that are otherwise invisible. And then, yeah, you know, the rest is history. That that was it.
Peter O'Toole:I'd love to know what percentage of scientists had that at that really early age because there's a fair few and there's others that came to science much later. Yeah. It'd be quite interesting to know how much that is. So so you've always been science driven. So what was your first degree, and where did you do your degree?
Anna Schüth:So, yeah, I had always been fascinated by science and, the well, what I said, I studied classic biology in I don't know. It's it's lower Saxony in Germany. It's it's called Gottingen. It's quite famous actually in Germany. And, yeah, there I did my degree, and I don't know to what, extent you now wanna go from science into math, because that had been really eventful, and that had been one of the key moments that I didn't realize at the time which shaped then the rest of, you know, the course of my life, let's say.
Peter O'Toole:So what so Yeah. What happened?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. So then I was I mean, I'm my parents, how to say they have 4 kids. Right? So I have 3 siblings. And then I was when I was, moving out for me, it was clear.
Anna Schüth:I wanted to go to study, and I really wanna learn more about science. And that was, for me, amazing. That's that was clear. So I went there, and my parents, they told me from the beginning, we do not have any money to support you. So I had to work multiple jobs, and this whole kinda almost poverty thing, I mean, sometimes I had not even money to buy food.
Anna Schüth:It was, in hindsight, ridiculous how I actually managed that, and then I was hitting a a a point, probably multiple reasons because then I failed a couple exams, had to work so much, and then I I thought, okay. This cannot go on. I don't know. I didn't even realize there would be a tomorrow. Right?
Anna Schüth:And this all ended in a suicide attempt. And then, I I mean, then I wouldn't speak about it, obviously. I wouldn't speak about it. It was just what it was. Luckily, now this was something where I'd say I came out of it a lot stronger.
Anna Schüth:I'm not saying this is something you should, you know, experience. Obviously, it's horrible, but this made me the person I am today so that yeah. I I would say I have become a more resilient person throughout this whole time, and I'm just so grateful. Every day I wake up and I'm so happy and I I can't even expand. Everything is just I mean, when you put it in relation to, you know, you had a bad meeting.
Anna Schüth:Oh, great. Or a stupid email. I mean, this is this is nothing compared to that when you think about it.
Peter O'Toole:And then you did your degree. You went on to a PhD?
Anna Schüth:First, I did a 3 year science, how do you call the scientific fellowship in Germany at the University of Lubeck. And there, I started with intravital to photon microscopy of the mouse cut. Yeah. And then, you know, you see all these things, life happening. You see the immune reactions.
Anna Schüth:You see nanoparticle uptake and so on. And that is yeah. I don't know how to explain it. It is absolutely amazing. And then I thought I didn't even realize that something like this would be possible.
Anna Schüth:And, yeah, that was it. So I I knew I'm going to stay in imaging. And since then, not one day has been boring or ever that I thought I wanna do something different. So
Peter O'Toole:Popper sort of scientific microscope.
Anna Schüth:Sorry? What what do you
Peter O'Toole:Do you remember what the first scientific so not the one you had at home, but, you know, the first sort of professional microscope you used. Do you remember what the first microscope was?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. That was, Leica 2 photon, and they also had, back in the days called STLA vision, like a triumph scope. Mhmm. There, it's, what was an institute of biomedical optics where they had different types, and then they could play around with a different setups and so on. And yeah.
Anna Schüth:So intravital to photomicroscopy.
Peter O'Toole:So why the move to MastFit after that?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I I wanted to experience a little bit, life abroad. And then for whatever reason, I went to a conference in Zurich and then I thought, oh, Zurich is really awesome. So I was thinking Switzerland. Then I talked to a few people at the poster session.
Anna Schüth:They said, you know what? Netherlands is great. I thought, okay. I never really thought about it, but then I looked up, a couple of, job advertisements. And maybe it's, you know, sometimes things happen how they should happen also, and there was this position in mastery, on incontinence, actually, on letter research.
Anna Schüth:And I thought, okay. Got a letter. It's not too far away. Maybe I just try. And I applied.
Anna Schüth:It was actually a military fellowship and got it. That was that. I mean I mean yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Was it last week?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Exactly. And since then, I'm here. So that was 20 when did I apply? 2010.
Anna Schüth:And 2011, I came to Maastricht, and since then, I'm here. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:So you've been in Maastricht now for 13 years?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. It's it's yeah. I should totally get a Maastricht tattoo now. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:You haven't got anything to mark master it. Duh.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Well, the the the science stuff. Okay. Right? So that kinda counts.
Peter O'Toole:That's the strange thing because we live in a world where everyone is passionate about microscopes. Let me the vast majority are, I think, at that point.
Anna Schüth:I don't know. Yeah. Maybe. I don't know. I I think, there's a different type of passion.
Anna Schüth:Right? There's this passion of, hey. I wanna get good results and apply it to something, or I really wanna get my hands on it and build it and so on. And over the years, I have seen different types of passion, I would say. And, yeah, some that's maybe stand out.
Peter O'Toole:So That's right there. And if you think about the conferences, you have the end users, you have the developers. Yeah. So there there is that, and you have the enablers. I I think that's the biggest one.
Anna Schüth:That's also something I really like is to be somewhere the the person that build just builds a bridge, that you have. The people, the, well, the clinicians, you have the data scientists, you have the biologists, and they all speak a different language. And they I think the whole aspect of science communication is so important in finding a way to communicate this. So yeah.
Peter O'Toole:So on your, your voluntary side as well. So you've got a full time job. You've got family, people come to you. And you've got time for volunteering as well.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I mean, it had to take a little bit of a back seat, but, I mean, depends on what you call volunteering and whatnot. But I have been, a few years ago, I have been volunteering for Dragonfly Mental Health, which is a global mental health organization. So everyone who's listening can just type in Google Dragonfly Mental Health, and they have lots of amazing resources and things, available online. And then I would, for example, when I a few years while back, I started my blog.
Anna Schüth:It's, I call it academic matter house, blog. And while uploading a story takes a couple of minutes, you can do that after work or something like that. But that was something I definitely was passionate about. After probably 10 years of, mentoring high school girls in the field of STEM, I kinda paused that for a bit. And then I'm also a member of the so called Maastrichtang Academy that is really passionate about changing things in academia that could be changed and policy making and so on.
Anna Schüth:And they just now took the lead of the outreach group. But that is well, I don't know. I don't call that volunteering, I would say.
Peter O'Toole:Okay. So within all that, and do you think that actually helped you get your academic post, or did it hinder? I I think I know what the answer is to this, but I'm gonna ask anyway. Doing all this voluntary stuff, this extra stuff outside of just being in the lab, do you think that was beneficial to your career?
Anna Schüth:That's a good question, and I would say, I mean, I'm not sure. I mean, now, there is this time where we in the in the Netherlands have this, rewards and recognition where we say everyone should be recognized and rewarded for their unique talents. Some people are excellent teachers. Others are super good in grant writing. And, obviously, in a way, you need to do both, right, or all the different things, but, it's great to have unique talent.
Anna Schüth:But I would say back in the day when I have done this, it was maybe rather a bit of a hindrance. And it's a I have to be careful how to formulate this, but, obviously, you you were asked well, I was asked to do a lot of lab work then. You know, when you are PhD student, you have to do certain things. When you're a postdoc, you have to do certain things. With getting higher up, you have a little bit more independence, and then you need to figure out what to do with your time on your own.
Anna Schüth:But yeah. But I but I think times have changed. And now I would say, if you get the opportunity, do it. However, I also wanna say that I've never done anything because it looks good on the CV because that's nonsense. I mean, that doesn't work.
Anna Schüth:Then.
Peter O'Toole:You're not gonna volunteer for singing. You're not going well, you shouldn't volunteer for singing. You're not going to enjoy. I I didn't imagine that actually it's probably helped you in in being able to juggle because you'd have had those aspects. And actually if you looked at a CV and you saw someone who volunteered and they're passionate about it, it shows they can create time and you know you should be able to have more than one thing in your life.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. And it's not Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Work. And I think that volunteering is part of your other side.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. By now, it is also this case. And I I think even when you go for these larger personal grants, now that they also will say, hey. What have you done in terms of outreach, and what have you done in terms of, I don't know, yeah, these kind of things, you know, advocacy and then being a member of these specific groups. But back in the day, it, it sounds like I'm god knows how old, but then it wasn't quite like that.
Anna Schüth:Then it was really about this, what's the impact factor of your journal? How many papers do you have? And I'm thinking we are going a little bit in the direction where, you know, more the the other things are counting and, the yeah. Open science, you know, all these things.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. And that's the same in the UK, actually. Very, very similar now that e even CV, the government funding, you don't put in a CV. You now have to do a case about which includes your outreach, your impacts, and your other bits around. It's not all about applications, which is which is healthy to a degree, but you still have to publish, obviously.
Peter O'Toole:And digital publishers, actually, if you for those who are listening or watching, what is your blog website address? It's it's quite easy, but
Anna Schüth:It's my name.
Peter O'Toole:That is
Anna Schüth:It's my name. It's it's it's anashi.com. And the reason being was that I was well, the story behind it is that I was, working in the pandemic in the lab. And, well, let's say I was working in the pandemic, online and also in person a little bit. And there, I came across a few people that were dealing with either suicide attempt, suicide attempt of a family member.
Anna Schüth:And then the tip of the iceberg was that, former colleague of mine told me that she had an abortion, and she doesn't think that you can have kids in your PhD. And then she said, hey, Anna. You had a child halfway through your PhD. If you maybe speak about this more, maybe more encouraged to actually have a child as well. And I could not believe that this was a thing.
Anna Schüth:And, then I thought, you know what? I called my brother and said, hey. You know how to make this website. You know? Can you please help me?
Anna Schüth:And then he did this for me, or we did it together. I uploaded the first couple of own personal, stories, and then I thought I need a name. What could I name this blog? I don't know. Whatever.
Anna Schüth:And he said, yeah. For now, it's your name, and then you can later on change it. Yeah. Well, the day never came. The website never finished.
Anna Schüth:The name never finished. And then I thought, who cares? I just wanna get these stories out, and then it went completely viral. I couldn't believe it. I mean, by now, I think, yeah, several million people write these stories, and I shared them also on Twitter.
Anna Schüth:Never had social media really before this block, and I only started Twitter actually to share the stories. And 100, if not 1,000 messages have reached me. People saying, hey. You helped me so much feeling seen and heard. And, and then the great thing was when someone said, hey.
Anna Schüth:I I feel recognized in this particular story. Can you share mine? And then I thought, okay. And then it had to pause at some point because it was getting too much. Yeah.
Anna Schüth:That was the story.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. And I've gotta say, well, go to your other as well, though, because the website looks really cool when you go to it. I do like the signature. Well, I thought that was a really nice touch.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's it's it's actually true. I got a lot of, comments on that and, yes, I was picky about a few things, but then, I mean, obviously, the research section still really needs quite a bit of work. And that's something I now think because I also like, I've done a few events.
Anna Schüth:For example, this brain science meets, data science and microscopy with pint of signs in a path and sharing signs, and it was really fun that I thought I should post pictures of that, like I put on Twitter, and then also linking protocols and making it more open access, actually. Because I really like what people are doing there, but, you know, I'm just one person.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. It doesn't stop there though, has it? Because they've been writing articles. So you've got you've got your lab science.
Anna Schüth:Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:People also have your mental health sciences going in Yeah. The likes of nature and other magazines. So the popular magazines, the the late public magazines Mhmm. As well as the actual sort of the hardcore niche science journals and magazines.
Anna Schüth:So Yes. Actually, true. I mean, so it's now in Nature, Science, Wiley. Yeah. As I said, another Nature invited, papers, up and running, and I have a couple more things up my sleeve, but I will not, get shocked about it.
Anna Schüth:But, that was then for me also completely, I don't know, surprised that someone or, these editors would say, hey. I write your blog. Fantastic. Would you write for us? Yeah.
Anna Schüth:I mean, that's so cool because why I've done it, not so much again that it looks great on my CV or what. That was really never the point. The point was give this a larger platform. Give this a larger platform that I say, hey, bring mental health on the agenda. And then it, made waves in that sense that I was invited to speak at, for example, PhD, how do you say, retreats and so on and directly to the PhD students, but also to the supervisors for their night.
Peter O'Toole:So Well, and I was going to point out that, you know, even if you're listening, watching, and you don't suffer from mental health or don't think you're suffering from mental health, it's worth reading some of the blogs because you might recognize it in other people around you that you may not otherwise. It helps you pick up the symptoms earlier. Yeah. And then they get in to actually offer support or to raise this because quite often the person involved you're meant to have doesn't necessarily recognize it first themselves. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:You're useful to bring it up.
Anna Schüth:It's it's it's absolutely true. And, I mean, this was also why I did with, with another colleague or colleague slash friend from the law faculty, Mark Kawakami. We founded this flourish master. This group actually to increase the mental health support, but also the whole literacy around it because I think I truly believe is when you know more about it, it's, you know, really helpful. Also, realizing what your colleagues might go through and what is actually being what does it mean being on the autism spectrum?
Anna Schüth:You know? What does it mean to have ADHD? What does it mean to have a chronic disease and so on? And, yeah, it's it's, important, I feel. But, yeah, we have been hibernating also for some time, but we were we were think, of maybe getting new members and so on and then see that we can get this up and running.
Peter O'Toole:You also some of you well, you've beamed an interview on podcasts. You've been in my seat on podcasts. What's it like being that side of a podcast?
Anna Schüth:You mean being being a host?
Peter O'Toole:What's it like being like being the guest of a podcast rather than the other way around?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Yeah. Because I had been, the host of a campus podcast in data science. Well, you don't have to prepare. You don't have any work.
Anna Schüth:Right? You don't have to set up any kind of, technology and so on. And, yeah, it's really fun. I mean, either way. Right?
Anna Schüth:It's fun to share your story and so on, but I do also really enjoy having a guest talking about whatever kind of different topic because I think every time someone has a story to tell and you learn something. And I always say a day where I didn't learn anything is, almost like a wasted day or so, and I try to make sure I learn something new every day. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:So you had, we we we talked about some of the volunteering. The other big chunk of your the other half of your life is not more than the the other half of your life for your children. I think you've got more than one child, haven't you?
Anna Schüth:Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:I'm sure.
Anna Schüth:Well, not not quite half because I am now 43, I have to think. And my son is turning 10 in 4 weeks, and my daughter has turned last month 5. So, yeah, that's that's definitely well, obviously, having a child halfway through a PhD, that was quite something. It was definitely a challenge. In hindsight, I don't even know how I've done this writing a book with a baby crawling on the floor.
Anna Schüth:Many, many sleepless nights, but I've done it. I defended my, PhD when he was 1 year old. But by the time, I was already postdoc. So that was a tough time. And, I mean, when you are a good team, the entire family, then, that works.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. But it's it's it's been, tough. And, I mean, when I don't know, how to say that. This is this is obviously another thing I'm really passionate about is this whole women on maternity leave. And because another interesting story of mine is actually that when I now am this laureate of the so called award, which is quite, yeah, good for Dutch scientists, and I was invited to the interview already, a year before I was awarded.
Anna Schüth:I was awarded 2020 and the year before. And that round of interview didn't work quite as well because I was in labor. I mean, I was standing there, 30 kilos extra. I travel breathing, and I thought, oh, please, baby, stay in there for another hour. It was I mean and now I'm laughing about it, but in that moment, I'm in pain.
Anna Schüth:I'm thinking I'm worried because I was unemployed at the time with the idea of being at home with 2 kids was, no. Not so great, you know, but okay. Or maybe yeah. What can I say? That was not a a great situation to be in.
Anna Schüth:Unfortunately, it didn't go through, so they had no mercy with me, although, I had very high grades, but okay. What I liked was that, now president of the university back then, Rector, she said, hey. Come to my office. Tell me the story. How can it be that they invite you on that day to the interview?
Anna Schüth:And then, I put it on social media, and I remember I got a lot of, reactions. And then another funding organization reached out to me and said, hey. Let's talk. Then we had a couple meetings, and afterwards, they actually changed this whole scheme. You can now upload a video.
Anna Schüth:And, I thought it is impossible to have 2 days in the year, but if this one particular day falls on the day you go into labor, I mean yeah. So that's why I was very, how to say, doing quite some efficacy on you can't have an interview even in your maternity and afterwards. And, the amount of women that reach out to me and said, yeah. I went there breastfeeding. My baby was in intensive care and I had to prepare, interview with it.
Anna Schüth:This is yeah. No. I mean, this is this is not showing not out of the
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. Yeah. Did you take much time off after having your child? We we let's go to the second one. So you have 5 years.
Anna Schüth:I mean, this is another thing. I think I think you should never call it time off because a maternity leave is really I mean, it's what is it? Feeding and changing diapers and you are busy. You know? You are really busy.
Anna Schüth:So it's it's not you don't have time for anything else, basically. And the time you have in the Netherlands is this, yeah, 12 weeks, 16 weeks, range, and that's it. That that that's the time you have with your baby, but I had a sick leave, which was many months. So I was from halfway through my pregnancies on sick leave, bed rest. So but that that was, also not really fun to experience.
Anna Schüth:But then luckily, I am, yeah, super grateful that I have 2 healthy kids. And, speaking to women in my environment, I realized that is, yeah, infertility is down, and so on and the force. And I I mean, I touch upon this in my on my blog that I also lost one baby in between, at 11 weeks. And, yeah, that was something what I felt was needed to speak about it publicly as well. And, Yeah.
Anna Schüth:This was another one of these virus stories where so many women were saying they experienced this as well. What I really liked about it was the fact that I said, you know what? I talked to my former PI about this, and he said, take the time you need. So I took 3, 4 weeks off, and, I shared this online, and then some other women would say, because of you, I had the courage as well to ask for time off. Because going through something like this, you I mean, as far as I'm concerned, I I I would just go to the office and I would cry.
Anna Schüth:You know? I wasn't I was absolutely useless, and I remember my supervisor then said, why are you here? You know? Go home. And I know that this is, fortunate to have.
Anna Schüth:Not everyone has this, but I just really wanna wished that this would be possible for everyone. But number 1 is saying that you actually experience it. And I realized that most women are embarrassed to to share this with anyone for that matter. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Why do why do you think do you think it's makes everyone look weaker? Because I think from a male side, if there's any personal going on, be generally, they wouldn't try and show it to work. Is it because they're not wanting to show weakness, maybe?
Anna Schüth:It's, when it comes to mental health and anything like that, obviously, or any type of disease and so on, anything where you're struggling because in academia, there's high competition. You need to be strong. Why? That's what you think. Right?
Anna Schüth:And, with this whole topic on miscarriage and infertility, it's this whole, shame, I think. I mean, I most certainly didn't have that, but I know from, other women, they go through this. They say, I I feel like I, yeah, this sounds absolutely ridiculous, but as in it's the duty of me as a as a woman. I need to be pregnant. I need to be capable of having a child, a healthy baby.
Anna Schüth:And when I cannot do this, then something is wrong with me. And that's some yeah. That is very sad because, obviously, it's not your fault. And, yeah, that's
Peter O'Toole:yeah. That's the strength of the blog, isn't it? And the strength of sharing your story because, again, because so many people don't talk about it. Yeah. The prevalence isn't as obvious.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. Exactly. People will realize actually it's not normal, but it's normal. It's not it's not there. They're not alone.
Peter O'Toole:It's not in the UK. It's not seem to be ashamed of. It's not it's it's life. I mean, it's it's so which is why it's so important to share that. I I I would agree with you.
Anna Schüth:It's it's absolutely true. And, I mean, that's why I said the amount of women that would, reach out to me. And then also once I shared mine, a couple other shared theirs. And I think one of the most horrific ones was when someone, another woman shared that she was at her PhD. How do you call this Viva, I think, in in the Netherlands in the UK.
Anna Schüth:Sorry. And at that moment, she at this very moment, she miscarried her child. And I don't wanna get too graphic, but it's obviously you are in horrendous pain. And how can you and she would say she wouldn't yeah. She would mask it.
Anna Schüth:I don't even know how. And then the how can that be? You know? And then others would say, oh, I experienced this the same the same and and and then, it really helps. Plus, also, those who have written say it was almost like a therapy effect.
Anna Schüth:I mean, I'm not saying it's therapy. Please don't get me wrong, but the whole writing aspect is is very, helpful in this moment when you maybe have never spoken about this with anyone. Have you reflected,
Peter O'Toole:with your your advocacy and, making things aware, how many people's lives you may have affected in a positive way? You ever thought about that?
Anna Schüth:Do you mean how many people have affected my life in a positive way? No.
Peter O'Toole:No. No. The other way around. How many peep you because you've never got the content, the people have read it. How many people have you actually helped?
Anna Schüth:I don't know. I don't know. Have you ever
Peter O'Toole:thought about it? Just how many have you
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I I don't know.
Peter O'Toole:Positive influence.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. If you just look at the hard facts, so to say, which is maybe, let's say, a DM on Twitter or maybe also on LinkedIn, I mean, you can count them, and I think I stopped counting at a couple hundred. I don't know. But way more, than the comments on social media, several hundred. I don't know, honestly.
Anna Schüth:And and lots of people say, well, I am following quietly along, and I don't comment or I never really because you know? And then that that's that's a good question, and that's why I said that the views are several million, so you you count. I don't know.
Peter O'Toole:It'd be a lot, and I think that's something to be really proud of and an amazing accomplish accomplishment.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I don't know. I mean, that is, in a way true, I think. Yeah. I don't know.
Anna Schüth:And and I never really thought, oh, I'm so proud of this accomplishment. I always thought, my god. These people are suffering in silence. I wish to help, and I always thought, what can I do? I'm just one person.
Anna Schüth:But this is an example of what can you accomplish if you are just one person. Then you ask another person for help. And and then I remember when I went to, I went through the forest for a walk with a friend of mine, and I told her about this. Yeah. I have this idea of doing this vlog, but I'm really afraid.
Anna Schüth:I was nervous. You can't even comprehend how nervous I was and so afraid because, I mean, who is putting a story of their own suicide attempt on the Internet? I I I thought this not in a gazillion years would I do this. And then, she said, yeah. It's a great idea.
Anna Schüth:Do it. And I thought, okay. Hit online. And then I go, oh god. It's online.
Anna Schüth:And then, you know, you wanna hide under under somewhere, but it's, it went it went well, I would say. So it's always this sometimes we need to push through fear. I mean, I I know it's hard, but this is there's always something on the other side, oftentimes, at least. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Moving on to the work life balance, how do you balance having your own lab now or starting your own lab, having your children? How how do you how do you balance that?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. So it's a good question, and I think and sometimes I wonder if there's such a thing as a work life balance. But I also do believe that having children is actually helping me more than the other around. I mean, obviously, it's it's, it's a blessing to have them. But I sometimes thought, back in the day, my PhD supervisor said, oh, they are helping you.
Anna Schüth:And I thought, hey. What does he mean? They're helping me. And if they if I wouldn't have children, I think I would only be doing advocacy and working and in the lab and so on. And this is actually taking time off and learning to be in the moment.
Anna Schüth:So last week, we, had a week of holidays, and it was just, you know, water, ice cream, kids. That's it. No lab, no meetings, no nothing. And I have to be honest, I've struggled with that before, this whole taking time off and also mentally. You can sit somewhere but be not present.
Anna Schüth:You know? You can be with your mind somewhere else. And it is, in academia, especially really hard, and I it took some transition time for sure. And, I would say my number one tool for this is the running.
Peter O'Toole:Which I was also going to say because it it's Yeah. You've got your family, got work. But, actually, would you say running is your Yeah. Mind where you kind of have a bit of space to think
Anna Schüth:Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Otherwise. And that I run and I know when I run, I can just think about anything and there is sometimes it's work, sometimes it's family, sometimes it's anything.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. I noticed you've ran your was it your first marathon recently?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Yeah. Congratulations. Yeah. Thanks.
Anna Schüth:It was, actually last September, and, yeah, I'm running for, I think, now 30 what am I saying? Since I'm 30. So since I'm 30, so that's now several years. And, I I mean, I was already running, I don't know how many half marks on. I can't even count them anymore.
Anna Schüth:And then I would run one time up to 35 k, and then I thought, for whatever reason, I told myself I cannot run further, which is obviously nonsense, but this whole thing is, it sounds also very strange and you will understand, but this this is a mindset shift as in I thought, you know what? I'm doing it. I'm training now. This is the plan. I stick to the plan, and then it will be fine.
Anna Schüth:And then the day came, and then I ran, and then it was completely mind blowing to me that my legs were really cool with it. So they were saying basically, hey, another 10 k is good. But, yeah, it's we are capable of of more than we think. That's the whole point, I think.
Peter O'Toole:So, Jonathan, next.
Anna Schüth:So, I mean, I'm intrigued by at least, let's say, 50 Kenya or so. But, yeah, I don't know. I think maybe it's healthy to do another 42 and then see, but, I mean, those 8 k. I mean Have you done, Ultra?
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. No. I did a 24 hour 100 mile Oh my god. Run a couple of years ago. But Florio Florio and Jack does similar.
Peter O'Toole:He he does super but, actually, it's not that hard. It's just pacing. A bit like your marathon, if you pace it, run it, you're good. If you go a bit too fast or too hard, you don't actually, I I would rather I'd rather run the 24 hour than try and race a marathon.
Anna Schüth:Okay. Yeah. No. Truly agree. I mean, this is this is this is also something I found very important, to not think anymore about time.
Anna Schüth:I mean, there was a time where I said I leave my watch at home. I'm not even tracking that because I lost the whole fun. It was only about, oh, no. I didn't hit my training goal. And, oh, that's bad, and I don't have my mileage.
Anna Schüth:And then I thought, okay. This this is not good. I need to enjoy the trees and the birds, and then it became fun again. So it's not about time. No.
Peter O'Toole:See see, in spring, I will go and count the number of species of bird I can hear or see. So it's very so so that means sometimes you'll stop
Anna Schüth:Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:And then and then carry on again. So it's it's it's much more running with a friend is is also you talk, and you you change your pace to suit each other.
Anna Schüth:And that's Yeah. That's, I mean, that's something I'm asked all the time by my friends and other people. Even someone who follows me on Twitter and says, hey. Shall we go for a run? But, I cannot run with people.
Anna Schüth:I've done this in the past that I ran with colleagues. But, no, if I feel like I wanna go faster, please do not disturb me. I wanna race today, or I wanna do hill reps, or I wanna do whatever, or I wanna be super slow, and then I feel so bad. You know what I mean? It's just I wanna do my that that's that's my alone time.
Anna Schüth:Please do not take this away from me.
Peter O'Toole:No. No. I I would have said the same and Yeah. I definitely I I was running marathons by myself, training by myself, didn't I like my own company, my own pace, my own time, and then I ran with Stuart and
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Yes.
Peter O'Toole:And then so, actually, if he's running slow, I feel quite good about myself for going slow with him. So I get Yeah. But actually, if it's the other way around, I think, well, I've been in his position. He understands. And look, we can always go off if we wanted to, but we never do.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. But he doesn't mind. You know, if he's feeling fitter, he'll do a few stretches and back a while, do some sprints, and then come back. It's like we we are yeah. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:It works nicely. And actually, Elmi, we have a small running group, in the
Anna Schüth:I think I saw that on social media, and then I thought, oh, I don't know. I mean, I've seen these running groups, and I'm intrigued, but I don't know. I would feel, you know, there's this impostor syndrome thingy that's still come creeping into my my head and saying, yeah. You should run with them. They are so good, and look at you.
Anna Schüth:So,
Peter O'Toole:I know. It's just to tell me, it's not, again, it's not about time. It's just about Yeah. Talking to different people and just sharing. But all these weekly runs are by myself.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. 100%. Yeah. It it's definitely true. But, I mean, this whole what you said earlier about this, thoughts and running and so on, this is this, I mean, very, yeah, how do you say that?
Anna Schüth:I really recall after a long day in the lab as a PhD student, I would come home, take off my shoes, put on my running shoes. That was the first thing I've done, and then just run. And then there's this point of what, you know, how you call this, runner's high, whatever you wanna call this. But this not thinking, and I remember during my PhD, this was almost the only time I could switch off my head. Because there's always this, oh, no experiments and data analysis and writing and worrying, and you have a temporary contract, and then there's a child on the way.
Anna Schüth:I mean, this is stress.
Peter O'Toole:So Having children must make it more difficult to find the time to I I I think I'm really early. My my I'm older now. So I can run really early, so I'm back before they're getting out of bed most of the time, certainly the weekends.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. It's it's definitely a, a struggle, but I refuse to say, oh, I have kids. I can't. You know? Oh, I have children.
Anna Schüth:I can't. I mean, obviously, it's it's a lot tougher. But then yeah. What I just told you before we started recording, I, got a treadmill now, which is I always said, oh my god. How can you?
Anna Schüth:You know? For 10 years, I was only running outside, and now I really thought, k. You know what? If you wanna train for another marathon and you need to get your mileage, and how on earth are you accomplishing this? And I cannot leave my kids alone after the divorce being with them alone.
Anna Schüth:That's you have to be creative, and that's what it is. And on the bright side, what I really like is they know it. They know, okay, mom is doing that, or I got to run a, run a spaggy, and we would run outside and or do whatever type of workout, and they basically are born with that. So it's also, I hope, an example that they, follow at some point.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. I was gonna make do you actually listen to music on the treadmill?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I am team music. Oh, what do you mean? Yeah. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:You you do listen to music.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. When you
Peter O'Toole:want to play. So outside, I when I run outside, I don't use music at all. I like I like to hear my surroundings, but inside on a treadmill so what do you listen to?
Anna Schüth:I don't listen. I mean, it's it's a mix. Right? I like Madonna. I like all kinds of I will not say all kinds of music, but I have I don't know what to have on there.
Anna Schüth:Foo Fighters. Different things. Let's not talk about music. It's always so controversial. But, what I wanted to say was yeah.
Anna Schüth:I mean, obviously, when my kids are there and I have to listen to what they're doing, yeah, I cannot run with music. That's the thing. And yeah. But they know, this is this is what is it? 20, 30 minutes, I I cannot run a lot longer.
Anna Schüth:And, outdoors, I like music. I'm afraid that's maybe almost some people call it cheating. Yeah. I know that, but I really, enjoy that as well.
Peter O'Toole:No. It's cutie. Yeah. Does it does it hey. So I would ask if you about, like, some quick fire questions.
Anna Schüth:Okay? So are
Peter O'Toole:you an early bird or an eye town? Both. Okay. PC or Mac?
Anna Schüth:Oh, no Mac. No. Thanks.
Peter O'Toole:Okay. So oh, okay. So McDonald's or Burger King?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. McDonald's. Although, since I 1 year, I'm not vegan, And so that's why, I mean, McDonald's means for me, maybe a coffee or fries and, that's also I try to really eat more healthy and fries is not exactly but, yeah, obviously, the kids still like the happy meal and we go there. So McDonald's.
Peter O'Toole:Oh, coffee.
Anna Schüth:That is not a question.
Peter O'Toole:Coffee, coffee then, I presume.
Anna Schüth:Oh, oh, oh, fizzy coffee. I mean, a lot of coffee. That's that's one thing I can't get off. I mean, I also quit alcohol a year ago, and that's all good, but you can't take my coffee away. Coffee and running is something I need.
Peter O'Toole:I'll just take off my next question of a beer.
Anna Schüth:What what's your next question?
Peter O'Toole:Beer or wine? It's gonna be like that because you you stopped drinking.
Anna Schüth:But then it would be beer that was before.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. I will say, Anna, though
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Cut
Peter O'Toole:down your caffeine intake and have it before your long runs.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. It's
Peter O'Toole:Then you then you can actually get your yeah. You you bring down your receptors. You get enough some caffeine, kick for your long runs.
Anna Schüth:And I mean what I mean with coffee is also both normal coffee and decaf. It's just I like the taste and so I also yeah. But you see, I start to defend myself. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. We I yeah. We I've lots of decaf choices. Yeah. Chocolate or cheese?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Vegan, no cheese. But, I mean, obviously, you have vegan cheese, but it's, chocolate. I mean, that's definitely I still have dark chocolate, which I really like. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Mhmm. Now eat tin or eat hand?
Anna Schüth:Also, I prefer cooking myself and I know what's in there. Also, my kids both have a milk allergy, so I really enjoy if if you would have told me, 2 years ago, one day you would say that, I wouldn't have believed you because then I didn't like cooking at all. But now I really enjoy cooking and making healthy choices. Sounds lame, but it's true.
Peter O'Toole:Is that a new hobby?
Anna Schüth:Is it a question?
Peter O'Toole:A new a new hobbies, cooking over, the rest. It's I I don't see potential, but it's it's also good fun. TV or book?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I would say book, but now with kids and so on, we we watch sometimes movies and well, since kids, you know, the movie number goes up quite a bit. Before, it was books since my mom told me, in early school days, I had very quickly once I learned reading, 400 books also. I mean, she said you are glued to a book. I was obsessed with it and yeah.
Anna Schüth:Books. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Talk to a fiction, those books.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Well, as a child, fiction. Right? All kinds of different stories and so on. And now, also, yeah, a mix.
Anna Schüth:Okay.
Peter O'Toole:So What's your favorite film?
Anna Schüth:I like this is not embarrassing, maybe. I like Sleepless in Seattle, for example. I like my stuff a lot. I don't know. These guys
Peter O'Toole:Good answers. Star Wars or Star Trek? None. No? Not taken.
Peter O'Toole:I can't ask your favorite music because you said it'd be too controversial. So if you go away, are you someone who's gonna relax on the beach, or are you a culture vulture and wants to be going on it every day exploring new sites?
Anna Schüth:That's also I think that changes over the years. I mean, before I was definitely team I think teenager years, beach, then it was definitely culture, boring at the beach, and now it's it has to be a mix. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Isn't it? Yeah. The Netherlands or Germany?
Anna Schüth:I would say oh, god. My entire family will not cringe. I think by now that I live here for 13 years, it it became my home. My kids are here. So it's the Netherlands.
Anna Schüth:Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Oh, oh, god. I just offended. Also,
Anna Schüth:I mean, the the the whole mentality of the people, I mean, it's not so hierarchy. It's quite yeah. It's open. It's it's, well, I leave it there.
Peter O'Toole:That's a good, favorite technique.
Anna Schüth:Microscopy or what? What is it?
Peter O'Toole:Favorite microscopy technique.
Anna Schüth:Ah, favorite microscopy. That's a tricky one. I don't know. No.
Peter O'Toole:I don't know.
Anna Schüth:I I mean, I've worked for so many years. I won't say what was it? 8 years also with, also to photon, and I really like that. Pretty much the same amount with light sheet, so and to on. This one is a
Peter O'Toole:Here, it's good. I was guessing light sheet or 2 photon.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, obviously, I like other techniques as well, but everything has its place, I think.
Peter O'Toole:Okay. Writing a grant application or writing a paper for manuscript?
Anna Schüth:Mhmm. Grant application. Because it's more I don't know. There you can be a little bit speculative. It can be a little bit, yeah, what you wish to do, and, yeah, that's fun.
Peter O'Toole:Baby color?
Anna Schüth:I like blue, and I like black, but that's not a color, I think. And then, obviously, whatever sample you have, you look at the microscope, you look at, yeah. Probably lots of people say fluorescent colors. But I was just supposed to say, I don't
Peter O'Toole:think anyone has yet said Alexa Fluorescence, germaneolide, or GAPI or Yeah. Something. Yeah. Don't think anyone said
Anna Schüth:Then that that's that's something I thought are just too generic, so I'm not saying that, but then it would be red. I mean, I like good red. Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:Okay. So of that, we we talked about some difficult times. What would you say has been the best time in your career to date?
Anna Schüth:Well, that's a difficult one. I would say in every phase, there was a great time. I think looking back, you you see, you know, you zoom out and then you look at something where you are, for example, your PhDs, you feel like you're struggling, and it's really hard. Now I see the great aspects as well. And I would say in every phase of my career, the best times were when I was learning something new, and I was really integrated in a team and doing team science.
Anna Schüth:And I I would obviously say wherever I did microscopy, but that was everywhere, so the last 15 years. Yeah. Okay. So that's probably it.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. Yeah. We talked about starting a new lab. This is exciting times.
Anna Schüth:Yes.
Peter O'Toole:What's most scary? What are you thinking? Oh, this is this what what are you gonna what most daunting at the moment?
Anna Schüth:It's it's, a mix. Obviously, it's a mix. I mean, that's what I said when we were speaking about this earlier. It's something like, you are really scared of, but when you once you break over this hurdle or you break through this fear, there is something exciting over there. And what I what I'm really excited about is this whole topic of, patient driven cancer research being among the these other researchers that work on the same.
Anna Schüth:There's such a team spirit. I like that a lot. Scary is this, yeah, I need funding, for example. What I treated a few days ago, another grant that fell through. Yeah.
Anna Schüth:But I am not, I don't know. I'm not scared. It's about I mean, too too scared. You know? I mean, the scary part, I think, was this, oh, shall I shall I, after 8 years of working here, switch and almost, like, start over at my age.
Anna Schüth:Once I made this decision, a lot of the scary part was taken away, I would say.
Peter O'Toole:Yeah. Thank you for the support from your universities to take you into the position. So you're also supported, and you have their endorsement, which is a a very strong point. How did you feel when the grant was unsuccessful?
Anna Schüth:Well, that is unfortunate. I mean, then you think, too bad, I try again. I mean, it's it's never really not who wants to hear that? But I always believe in this sounds lame, but rejection is redirection. Because then I reached out to my collaborators and so on, and they said, we still believe in that idea.
Anna Schüth:I most certainly believe in that idea, so let's go for it. Take another call, write a new grant, and we will submit that soon, and let's hope that this works then. It's all fine.
Peter O'Toole:It is quite quite I think a few hours, you feel pretty pretty rubbish for a few hours. A bit disappointed, but then certainly after a sleep, generally, those No.
Anna Schüth:No. I I mean, I understand what you mean, and that was maybe I felt like this maybe in my PhD when I got, like, certain criticism on something where I thought, oh, I really like that. For example, you write your first article, and then it gets better and better. But with this one, it was maybe, I wanna say, I'm not going to lie, 5 minutes. And I thought, oh, yeah.
Anna Schüth:But is is this whole thing putting it in perspective? And that's why I say my the the, how do you say, the joy of being able to do this research is higher than this, and I know it's gonna work because I believe in that. And it's the same with when I was doing a specific, development of a microscope technique or when I was building the light sheet in our lab. When when you when people ask you, when is it finished? Or what are you actually going to do there?
Anna Schüth:What on earth are you doing the entire lab and a day in the lab? And as long as you believe this is going to work, then this is going to work, and it will. You know?
Peter O'Toole:I wouldn't say second time around because you've taken the criticisms generally. Those victims make it better. So the second time around, you realize the research you're doing is more mature. It's more thought about. It's more directed.
Peter O'Toole:So hits the ground running better than it would have been in the first. So Yeah. Yeah. But I take I take a few hours. I can't do it in 5 minutes, generally.
Peter O'Toole:Especially if I think it's a very good one. If it is if you put a chance in your arm, some some of you just feel more passionate about than others. Yeah. And and you really want you just feel as though it's just hit that note and it's just right.
Anna Schüth:I know. I know. I know what you mean. And I think when I this this one story I told you after I was pregnant, this interview, when I also got the no, I also thought, come on. That took me also maybe a couple hours, but that well, maybe a day or 2.
Anna Schüth:You know? But then you can't dwell on it too long, and then that's why I think, you know, back on the horse, you you I made this choice myself, so I might as well get on with it. So
Peter O'Toole:I've noticed just noticed, we are we have just gone the hour, and I don't know where that time's gone. I've gotta ask you one more question, though.
Anna Schüth:Yes.
Peter O'Toole:If you could do any job for a day, to try something different, whose job or what type of job would you like to try?
Anna Schüth:Yeah. I mean, as a child, I always wanted to be a veterinarian, so maybe that's something I would wanna do. Although I don't know. Maybe. I also like, maybe working in a museum.
Anna Schüth:Something completely different. Or something in the direction of zoology. I mean, this is still really cool. I don't know. Probably if I if I think about it more, there's or, I mean, anything with sports is also really fascinating.
Anna Schüth:You know, I stop here.
Peter O'Toole:That's cool. Anna, thank you for your time. I Yeah. I I wish we had longer, which was we could talk about and touch on. But, Annie, you've been a great guest.
Peter O'Toole:And also for those listening and watching, there is a mental health special as well with Kaydar and Beth, which should be coming up just before this episode. If you haven't seen it already, it's well worth a a listen too on that. And please subscribe to the channels. Please go and look at annashute.com, and have a look at, the content that's on there because it truly is inspiring. Anna, you are the person that is truly inspiring because that website is yours and your content.
Peter O'Toole:Anna, I'm very honored, and thank you very much for talking so frankly today.
Anna Schüth:Yeah. Thank you. The pleasure was mine. And, yeah, I, hope everyone is enjoying this episode, and maybe we can put in the little, I don't know how you call it, show notes or something, a few links to organizations. And I can send you an email that might be really helpful for those who seek help also, as well.
Anna Schüth:Yeah.
Peter O'Toole:That's certainly possible. So go to the YouTube. It will be on there, and we'll see if we can get it on the actual just the landing page as well. So, Anna, thank you.
Anna Schüth:Thanks a lot. Thanks.
VX:Thank you for listening to The Microscopists, a Bite Size Bio podcast sponsored by Zeiss Microscopy. To view all audio and video recordings from this series, please visit bitesizebio.comforward slash the dash microscopists.
